How is this for my situation?

A_N_91 · 01-02-2006, 03:52 AM

I'm 180 pounds and I want to lose around 15-25 pounds of unwanted fat. I'm taking in around 2220 calories, 280 grams of protein, 65 grams of fats, and 130 grams of carbs each day.

I do cardio on my off days and treat it like a workout with a pre-post meal. My cardio isn't sprinting but it's not low intensity walking either. I do around 3.5-4.3 MPH on a high incline 6%-10% power walk for around 45-60 minutes.

Since I'm on a calorie deficit diet, building muscle is impossible so I'm going to be working on gaining strength. I'm not doing a high volume because while cutting, I would just go crazy. So I'm going to do a split like this....

Monday-Bench
Wednesday-Squat
Friday-Deadlift

I would go to a certain max (usually 3-5RM) on the main lift, then do some sets of accessory lifts and do no more than 10 sets total. And each week, I would try to get atleast 1 extra rep or increase by 5 lbs. on the main lift. I'm not going to record the accessory lifts, only the main (Bench-Squat-Deadlift).

Also, another question I have is. Do all my food choices have to be from real food. For fats, I get it mainly from vegetable oils and peanut butter, carbs are from oatmeal and wheat bread. And protien is my biggest problem. The only source I have is chicken, and I'm buying whey soon. Is that enough? And the chicken is still hard for me to make because when I eat 5-7 meals a day, my mom says I'm gonna get fat so it's hard to get real food.

A_N_91

**A.FreeRadical** · 01-02-2006, 04:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A_N_91

...Also, another question I have is. Do all my food choices have to be from real food. For fats, I get it mainly from vegetable oils and peanut butter, carbs are from oatmeal and wheat bread. And protien is my biggest problem. The only source I have is chicken, and I'm buying whey soon. Is that enough? And the chicken is still hard for me to make because when I eat 5-7 meals a day, my mom says I'm gonna get fat so it's hard to get real food.

A_N_91

It looks like you have a pretty sound plan.

I would suggest olive oil over vegetable oil. It is better for your health. Peanut butter is ok, but you might try walnuts, almonds, cashews, pecans and peanuts for snacks too. Other good carbs are fibrous and leafy veggies. You need some of these in your diet everyday.

As to protein, I couldn't live on just chicken and whey only. Other possibilities are canned tuna and salmon. Lean beef, fresh fish and lean pork. A cheap source of complete protein is brown rice and beans (red, black, white, pinto, black eyed peas, etc.. This is a protein staple in the third world.)

Tell your mom that you need real food in moderate amounts 5-7 times per day so you can grow without getting fat. Good luck.

Gary

A_N_91 · 01-02-2006, 05:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A.FreeRadical

It looks like you have a pretty sound plan.

I would suggest olive oil over vegetable oil. It is better for your health. Peanut butter is ok, but you might try walnuts, almonds, cashews, pecans and peanuts for snacks too. Other good carbs are fibrous and leafy veggies. You need some of these in your diet everyday.

As to protein, I couldn't live on just chicken and whey only. Other possibilities are canned tuna and salmon. Lean beef, fresh fish and lean pork. A cheap source of complete protein is brown rice and beans (red, black, white, pinto, black eyed peas, etc.. This is a protein staple in the third world.)

Tell your mom that you need real food in moderate amounts 5-7 times per day so you can grow without getting fat. Good luck.

Gary

Ok, thanks. I can switch up fat sources....I'll try to get some tuna, but in New Jersey where I live, they're around $1.50 a can, sometimes up to $2.00. And for brown rice, since I'm in low carb, wouldn't brown rice give me too much carbs and not enough of the protein I need? And I forgot about beans having proteins, lol. I have lots of beans at home, so that's some good news.

I'll talk to my mom about eating 5-7 meals and hopefully she gets convinced. :fingersxd Chicken and beans I got tons of, so I'll be making my diet soon.

Also, if I do my cardio in the mornings, should I have some whey (2 scoops) in some water and go to cardio or should I do it without eating?

A_N_91

nextteenamateur · 01-02-2006, 03:08 PM

Be careful going heavy in squats and deads week after week - especially since you're in a calorie deficit. If I were you, I might only do deads every two weeks, or at least cycle the types of deads you do. Go heavy with regular deads on the first week, then do rack deads, etc. Just my two cents. Good luck!

sulcop · 01-02-2006, 03:51 PM

My question is on the diet, where did you start calorically? I ask only because you have not left much room once metabolic acclimation happens. It will happen, no way to stop it. Also on cardio, why no HITT? I can recover a ton of information showing HITT as muscle spairing but long sessions are not. All data to the contrary is 10 years old or better. There is also a metabolic shift with HITT and little or none with steady state type work. I also like to do my bench work between deads and squats for recovery. When I squat then deadlift my deads suffer. Also have you though of carb cycling? I don't mean to nit-pick, the plan is sound, but I think it could be tweeked somewhat.

Sully

**powerman2000** · 01-02-2006, 04:00 PM

I was going to recommend carb cycling as well. That would help with your metabolism and aid in muscle sparing.

A_N_91 · 01-02-2006, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sulcop

My question is on the diet, where did you start calorically? I ask only because you have not left much room once metabolic acclimation happens. It will happen, no way to stop it. Also on cardio, why no HITT? I can recover a ton of information showing HITT as muscle spairing but long sessions are not. All data to the contrary is 10 years old or better. There is also a metabolic shift with HITT and little or none with steady state type work. I also like to do my bench work between deads and squats for recovery. When I squat then deadlift my deads suffer. Also have you though of carb cycling? I don't mean to nit-pick, the plan is sound, but I think it could be tweeked somewhat.

Sully

I started from around 2600 calories. And I heard since HIIT is only 20 minutes, it's not enough for fat-loss. But can you post up some of the information on HIIT as being muscle sparing?

Yeh, I'll do Bench on Wednesday between Deadlift and Squat. And I'll carb cycle. Squat being high carb, Bench and Deadlift medium. High carb, I eat 2 times my bodyweight for the grams of carbs. Medium is my bodyweight in grams of carbs and the off days are low carb.

And for the cardio, if I end up doing HIIT, I'm going to do them on off days and like I said give it a pre-post meal, but if I do them in mornings, should they be empty stomach or should I have a shake with protein and carbs first?

A_N_91

sulcop · 01-02-2006, 05:41 PM

Check out my site and look under articles, I have one there on cardio and that should answer most of your questions. In a nutshell here it is. Walk for 45 min and lets say you burn 300 calories. Of that at best you burn off 100-150 calorie in fat the rest glycogen. The metabolic boost is slight and will stay elivated for perhaps 2-3 hours allowing for another 100-200 calories above BMR. Now 15 min all out killer cardio will burn the same 300 calories. Perhaps 80-100 will be fat the rest glycogen. The metabolic impact will increase BMR for up to 72 hours! That is three days above BMR! At say a 10% reduction in calories that could result in 20-30% increase in fat loss. Yes, do HIT Cardio on off days, always take in some whey or better yet BCAA's (xtend my favorite) pre/post. One more example, sprinters. Ever see a sprinter with small legs that lack muscularity? I have not. Ever see all those soccer mom's walking around the block? Evere see one with a 6-pack? As for HIT being muscle sparing, again go watch some sprinters. They do short HITT workouts 3-4 times per week. Now the guy down the road who is getting ready to run the NY marathon looks like he has a real estrogen problem to me. Why? Because he does! Low intensity high duration training is testosterone supressive man, thats why you never see a 220#, 5% B/F BB looking guy running for 1 hour at a clip. Back to sprinters, 1/2 the women could beat me for a most muscular award. Reason, they have altered there T to E ratio through there training. The other nice thing is your out in 15-20 min. and I never try to put more time in the gym then I do at the table with my family. One last thing, did you do a base line diet first? Read the article posted on the home page and get back to me with any ?? after. Good luck!

Sully

A_N_91 · 01-02-2006, 09:10 PM

Ok, I'm going to do HIIT on Tuesday-Wednesday-Saturday, and some powerwalking for 45 minutes on Sunday.

High carb days are 2 grams of carbs per pound of weight. High carb is Squat day. Medium carb days are 1 gram of carb per pound of weight and medium days are Bench and deadlift. And all the other days are low carbs which is .5 grams of carbs per pound of weight.

A_N_91

sulcop · 01-02-2006, 10:13 PM

Sounds solid, but at your age I would still like to see you increase your calories. Don't make any more drastic cuts and keep the good foods in, but take time to enjoy a slice of pizza here and there but only once every 7-10 days. I like the lifting program. Every teen I know prefers cable this and isolation that. I was 26 before I ever even did a lat pulldown, and that was 13 years of training. Take it slow and steady and post any questions.

Sully

A_N_91 · 01-02-2006, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sulcop

Sounds solid, but at your age I would still like to see you increase your calories. Don't make any more drastic cuts and keep the good foods in, but take time to enjoy a slice of pizza here and there but only once every 7-10 days. I like the lifting program. Every teen I know prefers cable this and isolation that. I was 26 before I ever even did a lat pulldown, and that was 13 years of training. Take it slow and steady and post any questions.

Sully

How should I setup the diet? How many calories, P/C/F should I have?? And for HIIT, how should I do that? Should I have something like 45 second sprint-15 sec jog or less intense like 30-30 or 15 second sprint-45 second jog?? And for low intensity on sundays, 3-4MPH on an incline for 40 minutes is fine?

And today I maxed out on squats and did some sets of Stiff-Legged Deadlifts, Leg Curls, and Lunges. I did 180x3 on squats but my spotter didn't show up so next week, when he's there, I can get 180x4 but I'm hoping to get 5.

A_N_91

sulcop · 01-03-2006, 01:37 AM

Keep upping the weight, but do not let form suffer. On the HITT start with 2:1 ratio of low intensity to high intensity so 2 min at say 5 MPH on a treadmill followed by 1 min at 7 MPH. That is just an example and can be used for any machine. For the diet I would say start with a 40-40-20 breakdown of carb/pro/fat and take in 25% of the carbs at your first meal (low GI like oats) 25% 2 hours before weight training (again low GI) and 25% post workout (fast acting) with the remaining 25% split over the remaining 3-5 meals (total 6-8 meals per day) To carb cycle just replace the calories from carbs with pro. on non-workout days for the post w/o carbs. There are many formulas to use to figure calories but the easy way would be to take the number 12 x bodyweight. Its not the best but works in a pinch. If you lose too fast add 500 far a few days to make sure your at 1-2 pounds per week max. If your losing too slow subtract 200 for a few days and see if that jump starts your fat loss. Again this is just a ball park figure.

Sully

A_N_91 · 01-03-2006, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sulcop

Keep upping the weight, but do not let form suffer. On the HITT start with 2:1 ratio of low intensity to high intensity so 2 min at say 5 MPH on a treadmill followed by 1 min at 7 MPH. That is just an example and can be used for any machine. For the diet I would say start with a 40-40-20 breakdown of carb/pro/fat and take in 25% of the carbs at your first meal (low GI like oats) 25% 2 hours before weight training (again low GI) and 25% post workout (fast acting) with the remaining 25% split over the remaining 3-5 meals (total 6-8 meals per day) To carb cycle just replace the calories from carbs with pro. on non-workout days for the post w/o carbs. There are many formulas to use to figure calories but the easy way would be to take the number 12 x bodyweight. Its not the best but works in a pinch. If you lose too fast add 500 far a few days to make sure your at 1-2 pounds per week max. If your losing too slow subtract 200 for a few days and see if that jump starts your fat loss. Again this is just a ball park figure.

Sully

Ok, thanks, I'll do that. But last thing, how long should the HIIT be? 20 minutes?

A_N_91

A_N_91 · 01-03-2006, 08:16 PM

And for my diet, I'm a bit carb sensitive, so I take in lower carbs than protein on non-workout days. For Non-workout days I take in 65 grams of fat, 130 grams of carbs, and 280 grams of protien. On Workout days Monday-Wednesday-Friday, I take in 65 grams of fat, 370 grams of carbs, and 185 grams of protien. And HIIT is 20 minutes or should I go for 30?

A_N_91

**powerman2000** · 01-03-2006, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A_N_91

And for my diet, I'm a bit carb sensitive, so I take in lower carbs than protein on non-workout days. For Non-workout days I take in 65 grams of fat, 130 grams of carbs, and 280 grams of protien. On Workout days Monday-Wednesday-Friday, I take in 65 grams of fat, 370 grams of carbs, and 185 grams of protien. And HIIT is 20 minutes or should I go for 30?

A_N_91

I'm curious as to the layout of your HIIT.

What type, exercise interval times and rest times. Stuff like that.

A_N_91 · 01-03-2006, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by powerman2000

I'm curious as to the layout of your HIIT.

What type, exercise interval times and rest times. Stuff like that.

I'm going to start with it being a 2:1 for the rest time to the sprinting. So I'm gonna do 1 minute of low intensity like jogging then do 30 seconds of sprinting. But I'm not sure how much I'm supposed to go far. Is 20 minutes good or should I try to aim higher and go for longer?

A_N_91

**skelooth** · 01-05-2006, 01:53 AM

If you believe you are carb sensitive (insulin resistant) don't be afraid to drop carbs even lower. I'm a huge advocate of eating dietary fat. Obviously when you drop carbs, you raise fats

I'm part of a new wave of thinking about nutrition and a lot of people will argue against my low carb ways. But I do not think of it as low carb dieting, I think of it as high fat dieting

With that said, your plan looks solid. I am always very impressed when people your age spend the time to actually learn about fitness and nutrition. I only wish I knew at 14 what you know now.

A_N_91 · 01-05-2006, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skelooth

If you believe you are carb sensitive (insulin resistant) don't be afraid to drop carbs even lower. I'm a huge advocate of eating dietary fat. Obviously when you drop carbs, you raise fats

I'm part of a new wave of thinking about nutrition and a lot of people will argue against my low carb ways. But I do not think of it as low carb dieting, I think of it as high fat dieting

With that said, your plan looks solid. I am always very impressed when people your age spend the time to actually learn about fitness and nutrition. I only wish I knew at 14 what you know now.

K, thanks alot man. So for non-workout days, I'm going to take in
2220 calories
100 grams of fats--40% of total calories
50 grams of carb--Leftover Calories
280 grams of protien--Bodyweight X 1.5

Workout Days (High Carb Days)
2775 calories
60 grams of fats--20% of total calories
350 grams of carbs--50% of total calories
210 grams of protien--30% of total calories

And I'll be doing my cardio on non-workout days except Sundays around the same time I would do my workouts on a workout day.

A_N_91

01-02-2006, 03:52 AM	#1
A_N_91 Pro Stature Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New Jersey Posts: 849 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 11	How is this for my situation? I'm 180 pounds and I want to lose around 15-25 pounds of unwanted fat. I'm taking in around 2220 calories, 280 grams of protein, 65 grams of fats, and 130 grams of carbs each day. I do cardio on my off days and treat it like a workout with a pre-post meal. My cardio isn't sprinting but it's not low intensity walking either. I do around 3.5-4.3 MPH on a high incline 6%-10% power walk for around 45-60 minutes. Since I'm on a calorie deficit diet, building muscle is impossible so I'm going to be working on gaining strength. I'm not doing a high volume because while cutting, I would just go crazy. So I'm going to do a split like this.... Monday-Bench Wednesday-Squat Friday-Deadlift I would go to a certain max (usually 3-5RM) on the main lift, then do some sets of accessory lifts and do no more than 10 sets total. And each week, I would try to get atleast 1 extra rep or increase by 5 lbs. on the main lift. I'm not going to record the accessory lifts, only the main (Bench-Squat-Deadlift). Also, another question I have is. Do all my food choices have to be from real food. For fats, I get it mainly from vegetable oils and peanut butter, carbs are from oatmeal and wheat bread. And protien is my biggest problem. The only source I have is chicken, and I'm buying whey soon. Is that enough? And the chicken is still hard for me to make because when I eat 5-7 meals a day, my mom says I'm gonna get fat so it's hard to get real food. A_N_91

01-02-2006, 03:08 PM	#4
nextteenamateur Pro Stature Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Clemson, SC Posts: 336 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 6	Be careful going heavy in squats and deads week after week - especially since you're in a calorie deficit. If I were you, I might only do deads every two weeks, or at least cycle the types of deads you do. Go heavy with regular deads on the first week, then do rack deads, etc. Just my two cents. Good luck! __________________ My X-Factor bulk log: http://www.ironmass.com/forums/showt...d=1#post106271 My LipidFX log: http://ironmass.com/forums/showthrea...6900#post96900 ********* Discount Code for 5% Off: SPB296** RAW TESTED LIFTS: Dead - 455 Squat - 405 Bench - 230 (getting up there) Going for an 1100 pound total and beyond

01-02-2006, 03:51 PM	#5
sulcop Pro Stature Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Cape Cod MA Posts: 127 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 4	My question is on the diet, where did you start calorically? I ask only because you have not left much room once metabolic acclimation happens. It will happen, no way to stop it. Also on cardio, why no HITT? I can recover a ton of information showing HITT as muscle spairing but long sessions are not. All data to the contrary is 10 years old or better. There is also a metabolic shift with HITT and little or none with steady state type work. I also like to do my bench work between deads and squats for recovery. When I squat then deadlift my deads suffer. Also have you though of carb cycling? I don't mean to nit-pick, the plan is sound, but I think it could be tweeked somewhat. Sully __________________ www.SOAbodybuilding.com

01-02-2006, 04:00 PM	#6
powerman2000 The Old Moderator Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 4,084 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 197	I was going to recommend carb cycling as well. That would help with your metabolism and aid in muscle sparing. __________________ Don't forget to periodize Best BP 507 lbs competitive Best Squat 705 lbs competitive Best DL 650 lbs competitive Guns don't kill people, men who come home early do. My workout log http://www.ironmass.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6247

01-02-2006, 05:41 PM	#8
sulcop Pro Stature Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Cape Cod MA Posts: 127 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 4	Check out my site and look under articles, I have one there on cardio and that should answer most of your questions. In a nutshell here it is. Walk for 45 min and lets say you burn 300 calories. Of that at best you burn off 100-150 calorie in fat the rest glycogen. The metabolic boost is slight and will stay elivated for perhaps 2-3 hours allowing for another 100-200 calories above BMR. Now 15 min all out killer cardio will burn the same 300 calories. Perhaps 80-100 will be fat the rest glycogen. The metabolic impact will increase BMR for up to 72 hours! That is three days above BMR! At say a 10% reduction in calories that could result in 20-30% increase in fat loss. Yes, do HIT Cardio on off days, always take in some whey or better yet BCAA's (xtend my favorite) pre/post. One more example, sprinters. Ever see a sprinter with small legs that lack muscularity? I have not. Ever see all those soccer mom's walking around the block? Evere see one with a 6-pack? As for HIT being muscle sparing, again go watch some sprinters. They do short HITT workouts 3-4 times per week. Now the guy down the road who is getting ready to run the NY marathon looks like he has a real estrogen problem to me. Why? Because he does! Low intensity high duration training is testosterone supressive man, thats why you never see a 220#, 5% B/F BB looking guy running for 1 hour at a clip. Back to sprinters, 1/2 the women could beat me for a most muscular award. Reason, they have altered there T to E ratio through there training. The other nice thing is your out in 15-20 min. and I never try to put more time in the gym then I do at the table with my family. One last thing, did you do a base line diet first? Read the article posted on the home page and get back to me with any ?? after. Good luck! Sully __________________ www.SOAbodybuilding.com

01-02-2006, 09:10 PM	#9
A_N_91 Pro Stature Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New Jersey Posts: 849 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 11	Ok, I'm going to do HIIT on Tuesday-Wednesday-Saturday, and some powerwalking for 45 minutes on Sunday. High carb days are 2 grams of carbs per pound of weight. High carb is Squat day. Medium carb days are 1 gram of carb per pound of weight and medium days are Bench and deadlift. And all the other days are low carbs which is .5 grams of carbs per pound of weight. A_N_91

01-02-2006, 10:13 PM	#10
sulcop Pro Stature Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Cape Cod MA Posts: 127 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 4	Sounds solid, but at your age I would still like to see you increase your calories. Don't make any more drastic cuts and keep the good foods in, but take time to enjoy a slice of pizza here and there but only once every 7-10 days. I like the lifting program. Every teen I know prefers cable this and isolation that. I was 26 before I ever even did a lat pulldown, and that was 13 years of training. Take it slow and steady and post any questions. Sully __________________ www.SOAbodybuilding.com

01-03-2006, 01:37 AM	#12
sulcop Pro Stature Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Cape Cod MA Posts: 127 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 4	Keep upping the weight, but do not let form suffer. On the HITT start with 2:1 ratio of low intensity to high intensity so 2 min at say 5 MPH on a treadmill followed by 1 min at 7 MPH. That is just an example and can be used for any machine. For the diet I would say start with a 40-40-20 breakdown of carb/pro/fat and take in 25% of the carbs at your first meal (low GI like oats) 25% 2 hours before weight training (again low GI) and 25% post workout (fast acting) with the remaining 25% split over the remaining 3-5 meals (total 6-8 meals per day) To carb cycle just replace the calories from carbs with pro. on non-workout days for the post w/o carbs. There are many formulas to use to figure calories but the easy way would be to take the number 12 x bodyweight. Its not the best but works in a pinch. If you lose too fast add 500 far a few days to make sure your at 1-2 pounds per week max. If your losing too slow subtract 200 for a few days and see if that jump starts your fat loss. Again this is just a ball park figure. Sully __________________ www.SOAbodybuilding.com

01-03-2006, 08:16 PM	#14
A_N_91 Pro Stature Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New Jersey Posts: 849 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 11	And for my diet, I'm a bit carb sensitive, so I take in lower carbs than protein on non-workout days. For Non-workout days I take in 65 grams of fat, 130 grams of carbs, and 280 grams of protien. On Workout days Monday-Wednesday-Friday, I take in 65 grams of fat, 370 grams of carbs, and 185 grams of protien. And HIIT is 20 minutes or should I go for 30? A_N_91

01-05-2006, 01:53 AM	#17
skelooth eh heh heh Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Behind you Posts: 7,183 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 154	If you believe you are carb sensitive (insulin resistant) don't be afraid to drop carbs even lower. I'm a huge advocate of eating dietary fat. Obviously when you drop carbs, you raise fats I'm part of a new wave of thinking about nutrition and a lot of people will argue against my low carb ways. But I do not think of it as low carb dieting, I think of it as high fat dieting With that said, your plan looks solid. I am always very impressed when people your age spend the time to actually learn about fitness and nutrition. I only wish I knew at 14 what you know now. __________________

01-05-2006, 02:29 AM	#19
A.FreeRadical the Epicurean Bodybuilder Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 2,245 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 57