Can't decide which path to chose...

A_N_91 · 01-14-2006, 04:17 AM

No, not natural or non-natural. Lol.

I really can't decide whether to bodybuild or powerlift.

I would want to chose bodybuilding because I can clean bulk and stay lean for a long duration. Powerlifting, I'm thinking that I can eat clean and stay lean, but then, why are most powerlifters fairly high in bodyfat?

My long-term goal is to be 220-230 with a pretty low bodyfat, being lean.

If I bodybuild I would be able to bulk pretty cleanly. If I powerlift, would clean bulking work or should I bulk until I have a reason to cut?

And the only reason I'm thinking of doing powerlifting to get bigger is because most of the big guys like Tim Harold or Dave Gulledge or anyone else on the westside team are pretty big but none of them are lean unless they cut.

Ugh, my head hurts now:boink: :boink:

Edit- I was wondering, is it possible to clean bulk while doing a powerlifting routine, something like Westside??

A_N_91

**b-boy** · 01-14-2006, 04:56 AM

you can clean bulk and powerlift, i have quite a few powerlifters at my gym and none of them are fat, all have some abs, keep the carbs high, to keep your muscle's full and put on just enough fat to help cushion your joints, hell looks at three time worlds strongest man marius P. he's lean as shit and no one can touch the man strength wise, in his sport! you have to find your strong weight, my strong weight is not my heaviest but somewhere in between dieted down and bulked up...LOL hard to explain, theres just a certain body weight and bodyfat that im strongest at, and its not the upper end of the scale!!!

pu12en12g · 01-14-2006, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A_N_91

And the only reason I'm thinking of doing powerlifting to get bigger is because most of the big guys like Tim Harold or Dave Gulledge or anyone else on the westside team are pretty big but none of them are lean unless they cut.

Looks like you solved your own problem

A_N_91 · 01-14-2006, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pu12en12g

Looks like you solved your own problem

Yeh, but they've been bulking for years. I don't want to be 20+ BF for years and cut once in a while. I want to try to bulk and stay lean. I'm not saying I want to gain LBM without any fat added along, but I want to minimize the fat gains as much as possible.

A_N_91

**Peaked_18** · 01-14-2006, 04:54 PM

Powerlifting doesn't mean you have to be fat. Powerlifting is lifting the most amount of weight in 3 lifts at a certain weight. You can still be cut and eat a shit load, just make sure it works. That your maintaining and gaining muscle not both.

Get er Done · 01-14-2006, 05:05 PM

Peak18 knows....Powerlifting is great! i keep my bf 10-15%

A_N_91 · 01-14-2006, 05:06 PM

Well, I don't want to be a powerlifter just to have high numbers in the 3 lifts. I want to to powerlift to get bigger. So I'm saying, if I have a good clean diet, will I grow from doing a routine like 5x5, Westside, or something along those lines?

A_N_91

Get er Done · 01-14-2006, 05:26 PM

when i was a bber i couldn't gain size,then i started powerlifting and now im growing!

Lift · 01-14-2006, 06:52 PM

IMO Powerlifters have great thickness that your average bb couldnt hope to achieve

**DJSTARER** · 01-14-2006, 08:01 PM

The line between PL and BB is very thin. I know personally, many times, powerlifters are they way they are simply because of genetics. It's not that they really eat that much more over maintenance, more that they have both heavy meso AND endo qualities.

Watching the Met-RX championships this year, I was very suprised at how lean some of the competitors were.

At the same time, Ronnie Coleman, the hugest of huge, was a former PLer. He attributes his sickeningly developed back and legs to this.

Other questions you may want to ask yourself is "why am I doing all this anyway?" Are you splaying sports?

The fact is, I, and many other BB types, incorperate many "PL MoVes" into our routine. They stimulate different muscles and enhance overall hardness and strength.

Thats my 2 cents.

Don't forget your multi

**DJSTARER** · 01-14-2006, 08:02 PM

Oh yeh, and personally, the only real difference is Rep ranges. BBers should deadlift, squat and (of course) bench.

~~2Ripped4U~~ · 01-14-2006, 09:09 PM

Powerbuilding :bigthumbu

A_N_91 · 01-14-2006, 09:41 PM

I can powerlift but be a bodybuilder. Like I would use Max Effort and Dynamic Effort techniques to get big. So is it possible to train using a system like 5x5, Westside, or any program like that using heavy weight and as long as I have a clean diet, I can keep fat gains small?

A_N_91

**Peaked_18** · 01-14-2006, 10:05 PM

Wow, you are a complete n00b. Diet like a bodybuilder and train like a powerlifter and you will be fine as long as you know how much to eat.

**DJSTARER** · 01-15-2006, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peaked_18

Wow, you are a complete n00b. Diet like a bodybuilder and train like a powerlifter and you will be fine as long as you know how much to eat.

:yeah:

I was gonna say something... but, i try not to...

A_N_91 · 01-15-2006, 04:01 AM

Ok thanks. Chill out though, I know I'm a noob but we all started somewhere.

A_N_91

pu12en12g · 01-15-2006, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A_N_91

Well, I don't want to be a powerlifter just to have high numbers in the 3 lifts. I want to to powerlift to get bigger.

In that case, I would suggest a "Periodization for bodybuilders" routine

http://www.extremefitness.com/forum/...p/t-26036.html

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/keats2.htm

Drew1200 · 01-15-2006, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A_N_91

Ok thanks. Chill out though, I know I'm a noob but we all started somewhere.

A_N_91

Its cool man. If you're just starting out focus on the power-lifting movements. They'll add mass to you and make you grow. Add some cardio in 3x a week and you won't gain alot of fat (though it will slow your muscle growth a little bit).

My workouts have focused on powerlifting movements for the past year and a half and I've gained almost 30lbs since I started doing it, and without going over 13-14% bodyfat.

What weight are you at now? how long have you been lifting? what are your core lifts at? in my opinion if your goal is 220lbs while super lean, you're going to need to bulk up to 240 and then cut from there. I've tried the "lean-bulking" thing and the gains come so frustratingly slow its almost pointless (at least for me)

madcow2 · 01-16-2006, 09:49 PM

Superheavies in any either OL or PL will have relatively high bodyfat, there is no incentive not to even if 20lbs of fat only increases your total by 10lbs. It's about biggest lifts. Also PL kind of caters to itself, it has weight classes that are way out there compared to other sports and OL - basically a lot of people who are attracted to powerlifting are big framed and very heavy. Look at those who are not superheavies - look at Kirk Karwoski he's always been big and relatively lean. Look at the lower weightclasses. Bodyfat is all about diet.

**DJSTARER** · 01-17-2006, 12:02 AM

Those links are good. I prefer a "natural periodization." As posted above (all the different reps ranges and the corresponding hypertrophy), each rep range will trigger different gains.

I start by taking a weight on a certain lift for 4-6 reps. I stay with that weight untill I can do it for 10-12> After this, I drop the weight and start over. This technique is common, and keeps ur body growing.

There are times when this should be modified a bit. Such bodyparts as the legs and shoulders tend to respond to higher rep ranges. I cycle through ranges starting 6-8 on the low and and 15-20 on the high end for these muscles.

The fact is, with size comes strength, and with strength comes size.

01-14-2006, 04:17 AM	#1
A_N_91 Pro Stature Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New Jersey Posts: 849 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 11	Can't decide which path to chose... No, not natural or non-natural. Lol. I really can't decide whether to bodybuild or powerlift. I would want to chose bodybuilding because I can clean bulk and stay lean for a long duration. Powerlifting, I'm thinking that I can eat clean and stay lean, but then, why are most powerlifters fairly high in bodyfat? My long-term goal is to be 220-230 with a pretty low bodyfat, being lean. If I bodybuild I would be able to bulk pretty cleanly. If I powerlift, would clean bulking work or should I bulk until I have a reason to cut? And the only reason I'm thinking of doing powerlifting to get bigger is because most of the big guys like Tim Harold or Dave Gulledge or anyone else on the westside team are pretty big but none of them are lean unless they cut. Ugh, my head hurts now:boink: :boink: Edit- I was wondering, is it possible to clean bulk while doing a powerlifting routine, something like Westside?? A_N_91

01-14-2006, 06:52 PM	#9
Lift I Love IronMass.Com Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 825 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 11	IMO Powerlifters have great thickness that your average bb couldnt hope to achieve __________________ MrLiftALot@hotmail.com "King Kong Ain't Got Sh*t On Me..."

01-14-2006, 08:01 PM	#10
DJSTARER eating more folate... Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: State College, PA Posts: 4,049 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 114	The line between PL and BB is very thin. I know personally, many times, powerlifters are they way they are simply because of genetics. It's not that they really eat that much more over maintenance, more that they have both heavy meso AND endo qualities. Watching the Met-RX championships this year, I was very suprised at how lean some of the competitors were. At the same time, Ronnie Coleman, the hugest of huge, was a former PLer. He attributes his sickeningly developed back and legs to this. Other questions you may want to ask yourself is "why am I doing all this anyway?" Are you splaying sports? The fact is, I, and many other BB types, incorperate many "PL MoVes" into our routine. They stimulate different muscles and enhance overall hardness and strength. Thats my 2 cents. Don't forget your multi __________________ My philosophies on training: "Extreme training yields extreme results" "Just because you can, does not mean you should" "The best program is the one you are not doing" Penn State Powerlifting-181 lb weightclass PGA Professional of America Current Stats: 474 Squat 601 Deadlift 320 Bench Goals for next training cycle: 500lbs squat and a total over 1400 in competition

01-14-2006, 08:02 PM	#11
DJSTARER eating more folate... Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: State College, PA Posts: 4,049 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 114	Oh yeh, and personally, the only real difference is Rep ranges. BBers should deadlift, squat and (of course) bench. __________________ My philosophies on training: "Extreme training yields extreme results" "Just because you can, does not mean you should" "The best program is the one you are not doing" Penn State Powerlifting-181 lb weightclass PGA Professional of America Current Stats: 474 Squat 601 Deadlift 320 Bench Goals for next training cycle: 500lbs squat and a total over 1400 in competition

01-17-2006, 12:02 AM	#20
DJSTARER eating more folate... Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: State College, PA Posts: 4,049 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 114	Those links are good. I prefer a "natural periodization." As posted above (all the different reps ranges and the corresponding hypertrophy), each rep range will trigger different gains. I start by taking a weight on a certain lift for 4-6 reps. I stay with that weight untill I can do it for 10-12> After this, I drop the weight and start over. This technique is common, and keeps ur body growing. There are times when this should be modified a bit. Such bodyparts as the legs and shoulders tend to respond to higher rep ranges. I cycle through ranges starting 6-8 on the low and and 15-20 on the high end for these muscles. The fact is, with size comes strength, and with strength comes size. __________________ My philosophies on training: "Extreme training yields extreme results" "Just because you can, does not mean you should" "The best program is the one you are not doing" Penn State Powerlifting-181 lb weightclass PGA Professional of America Current Stats: 474 Squat 601 Deadlift 320 Bench Goals for next training cycle: 500lbs squat and a total over 1400 in competition

01-14-2006, 04:56 AM	#2
b-boy Gold Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 548 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 42	you can clean bulk and powerlift, i have quite a few powerlifters at my gym and none of them are fat, all have some abs, keep the carbs high, to keep your muscle's full and put on just enough fat to help cushion your joints, hell looks at three time worlds strongest man marius P. he's lean as shit and no one can touch the man strength wise, in his sport! you have to find your strong weight, my strong weight is not my heaviest but somewhere in between dieted down and bulked up...LOL hard to explain, theres just a certain body weight and bodyfat that im strongest at, and its not the upper end of the scale!!!

01-14-2006, 04:54 PM	#5
Peaked_18 a la commode Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 4,247 Recipes: 2 Rep Power: 96	Powerlifting doesn't mean you have to be fat. Powerlifting is lifting the most amount of weight in 3 lifts at a certain weight. You can still be cut and eat a shit load, just make sure it works. That your maintaining and gaining muscle not both.

01-14-2006, 05:05 PM	#6
Get er Done Pro Stature Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Canada Posts: 169 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 4	Peak18 knows....Powerlifting is great! i keep my bf 10-15%

01-14-2006, 05:06 PM	#7
A_N_91 Pro Stature Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New Jersey Posts: 849 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 11	Well, I don't want to be a powerlifter just to have high numbers in the 3 lifts. I want to to powerlift to get bigger. So I'm saying, if I have a good clean diet, will I grow from doing a routine like 5x5, Westside, or something along those lines? A_N_91

01-14-2006, 05:26 PM	#8
Get er Done Pro Stature Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Canada Posts: 169 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 4	when i was a bber i couldn't gain size,then i started powerlifting and now im growing!

01-14-2006, 09:09 PM	#12
~~2Ripped4U~~ Banned Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: NY Posts: 1,463 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 0	Powerbuilding :bigthumbu

01-14-2006, 09:41 PM	#13
A_N_91 Pro Stature Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New Jersey Posts: 849 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 11	I can powerlift but be a bodybuilder. Like I would use Max Effort and Dynamic Effort techniques to get big. So is it possible to train using a system like 5x5, Westside, or any program like that using heavy weight and as long as I have a clean diet, I can keep fat gains small? A_N_91

01-14-2006, 10:05 PM	#14
Peaked_18 a la commode Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 4,247 Recipes: 2 Rep Power: 96	Wow, you are a complete n00b. Diet like a bodybuilder and train like a powerlifter and you will be fine as long as you know how much to eat.

01-15-2006, 04:01 AM	#16
A_N_91 Pro Stature Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New Jersey Posts: 849 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 11	Ok thanks. Chill out though, I know I'm a noob but we all started somewhere. A_N_91

01-16-2006, 09:49 PM	#19
madcow2 New Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 7 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 0	Superheavies in any either OL or PL will have relatively high bodyfat, there is no incentive not to even if 20lbs of fat only increases your total by 10lbs. It's about biggest lifts. Also PL kind of caters to itself, it has weight classes that are way out there compared to other sports and OL - basically a lot of people who are attracted to powerlifting are big framed and very heavy. Look at those who are not superheavies - look at Kirk Karwoski he's always been big and relatively lean. Look at the lower weightclasses. Bodyfat is all about diet.