Macronutrient Ratios, Fat Loss and Muscle Gain

**A.FreeRadical** · 08-14-2005, 12:04 AM

(This is an article that I wrote several months ago. GameDayDog seems like he is getting serious about using the nutrition card to help get him where he wants to go bodybuilding-wise, so I thought I would post it here for his use (or anyone else's for that matter.) I don't know how long I might be able to access bb.com so I thought I better grab this while I can.)

Everyone has pet peeves. How people use macronutrient ratios here in these forums is one of mine. That peeve is what prompted me to write this article.

I see people posting ratio recommendations like 40/40/20, 45/40/15, 35/35/30, etc as if their ratio was inspired by divine inspiration to make all dietary nutrition self-evident. They offer these pearls of wisdom to folks who want to know how to eat to lose fat and gain muscle.

These recommendations are meaningless for a person to determine a balanced diet for fat loss. If someone wants to lose fat, gain muscle or maintain weight, other information is needed first. Giving a ratio is ass backwards from what is needed. (Of course, what foods you actually eat are important too, but I am not going into that here.) The examples below will show you how to calculate your own ratio for fat loss. (If you want to maintain or gain weight, you can use a deficit of zero (0) or a surplus in the calculations.)

What basic information do I need to calculate my requirements?

First, you have to calculate how many calories you burn per day. There are many online calculators to determine this. (http://www.fitday.com is one.) You need to know your basal burn, your everyday activities burn and your exercise activities burn. These added together are your daily caloric burn. For this discussion, a person weighing 188 lbs, who works out vigorously and does cardio, will burn about 3000 calories per day. For the days he doesn't workout and doesn’t do cardio he will burn about 2500 calories per day.

You need to know how much you weigh and how much body fat you have. (See the hundreds of threads at bodybuilding.com for determining body fat %.) From this you can determine lbs. of body fat and lbs. lean body mass (LBM). (Subtract body fat lbs from body weight to determine LBM.)

How many calories can I consume and yet lose weight?

It is generally believed that 1-2 lbs of fat is the optimum amount of fat to lose per week.. Anymore than this is stressful, may cause muscle tissue loss and is likely to be easily regained. A pound of fat is about 3500 calories. Theoretically, to lose 1 lb of fat you would have to have a caloric deficit (consume less calories than burned) of 3500 calories per week (500 calories per day). For a 2 lb loss per week you would have a deficit that is twice as much.

Can my calorie deficit be too high?

This is another consideration. There is a limit to how low your caloric consumption can go. You cannot have a deficit that is too large or your body will go into starvation mode. (Starvation mode, is when your body determines that adding fat is more important to its survival than preserving muscle mass.) If you don't eat enough you will likely gain fat and lose muscle. Your weight may remain unchanged or (you may get smaller with more fat). It is generally believed that your caloric deficit limit is about 10-12 times your LBM. For example, if LBM is 165 then you should eat at least 1650-1981 per day.

You can see that a person burning 2500 calories per day can't cut 1000 calories from his diet without going into starvation mode. He has to burn more (weight training and/or cardio) or he uses a smaller deficit. Someone who is much heavier or someone that burns more exercise calories could try the full 1000 calories. (Are you starting to get an idea why your macronutrient ratio may not work for someone else?)

Can I gain muscle while losing fat?

Yes, you can do both. It is a tricky balancing act, but small amounts of muscle can be gained while losing 1 – 2 lbs per week. If losing fat is all about having the right calorie deficit in your diet and burning the right amount of calories with daily activities and cardio, keeping or gaining muscle is about weight training.

To gain muscle you must do a sufficiently rigorous weight training program to work all muscles at least once per week. This program should include training sessions from 3 – 5 days per week and should last for 45 –60 minutes per session. My preference, while losing, weight is a program that uses minimal sets, with weight close to a lifter’s maximum for 4-6 repetitions. It should emphasize compound movement exercises (squats, benches, deadlifts, rows). There should be rest 2-3 minutes between sets. Lifting control should be with the negative and should explode with the positive. Other programs will work, but the one I describe here works well while doing a calorie-restricted diet. Remember, your energy is not going to be as high as if you were eating a maintenance level of calories.

I have managed to gain about .5 lbs. per week of muscles, while losing fat, over an extended period of time using what I have described here. Your mileage may vary.

For more information see http://www.ast-ss.com/. For information on muscles and exercises see http://www.exrx.net/Exercise.html.

How much protein do I need?

You need a factor of 1-1.5 x your LBM to make sure you have adequate protein for body repair and muscle growth. A factor of 1 is probably ok if you aren’t looking for much muscle growth. So in this example lets say a person is 188 lbs and has 12.2% body fat. That is 23 lbs of body fat. 188 – 23 = 165 lbs of lean body mass. Our hypothetical person wants to try for some muscle growth. We will use a protein factor of 1.2 and multiply times 165 = 198 grams of protein needed. There are 4 calories in every gram of protein so that equals 792 calories. For someone on a 2000-calorie per day diet, the protein calories to total calorie consumption ratio is 40%

How much dietary fat do I need?

This is more controversial, but here is my take on it. We need to consume fats to have healthy bodies. It is generally recommended that fats should not represent more than 30% of our caloric intake. It is also recommended that good fats (mono unsaturated and poly unsaturated) should be predominant over bad fats (saturated, trans fats, hydrogenised, etc.) Fat is very calorie dense, 9 calories per gram. I haven't seen a lower limit for fats, but I know it is very easy to consume 20% fat even on the strictest of diets. (You should include your fish oil, flaxseed oil, salad dressings, olive oil, peanut butter fats and oils from nuts as well as those lean hamburgers and fats in low fat foods.) So a using 20-30% range we can calculate how many grams and calories of fats are needed. I will use 25% in this example. If we have determined that we are burning 3000 calories per day (with exercise) and we are going to consume 2000 calories (a 1000 calorie deficit for fat loss), our fat will be 25% of 2000 calories = 500 calories. Divide 500 calories by 9 for grams = 55 grams of fat.

What about carbohydrates, how many do I need?

We have already determined that, in this example, protein should be 40% and fat should be 25% of a 2000-calorie diet (for this one person, who weighs 188 lbs and has a LBM of 165 lbs who burns 3000 calories per day, who wants to add muscle mass by using a rigorous exercise program, including weight training.)

2000 calories- 792 from protein - 500 from fats = 708 carbs calories divided by 4 per gram = 177 carbs. In this instance, this is 35% carbs. (I know some people have success with weight training and fat loss using low carb diets. I am not one of them. Carbohydrates are our primary source of energy. At a minimum, you should have sufficient carbs prior to workout and post workout.)

So... what is the ideal ratio?

What is ideal, and for whom? What is ideal for you is what will get you to your fat loss and muscle gain goals.

This hypothetical person, weighing 188, LBM of 165, doing rigorous exercise, consuming 1.2 x LBM in protein, who consumes 500 calories worth of fats and who wants to lose 2 lbs of fat per week (using the formulas above) will end up with a 40/35/25 p/c/f ratio. There is no way anyone could have predicted this ratio without knowing his personal information, his assumptions for factors and the calculations from above.

I have tried to make this explanation as simple as I possible can.

In summary, to make this work for you,
you will need to calculate how many calories you burn in a day
you will need to get a reasonably close estimate of your body fat %,
you will have to decide on protein factors 1-1.5 x LBM is a big spread. (1.2 should be enough. A higher number increases protein and reduces carbs. You need carbs for energy. No point in overdoing protein.)
You will have to determine your deficit limits. (To see if at 10-12 x LBM you are flirting with starvation mode. Otherwise, go with 1000 calories per week max.)

After you have done all of this, you must track your progress in detail. If you don’t have enough energy you will have to up your carbs. If you aren’t gaining any muscle, you will have to up your protein and your weight training. If you lack energy and are not gaining muscle, you may have to lower your deficit and lose fewer lbs. per week. Bottom line, this is all about you. Your ratio is only good so long as it is doing what you want it to be doing for you.

Ok, now you know how to do it.

The next time someone else tells you to use his ratio, send him this article and tell him to make sure he has his ratio right first. Chances are, he is using someone else’s ratio.

Other resources:

Lifting for Fat Loss–10 Take Home Points
http://t-nation.com/readTopic.do;js...titan?id=517831

*

vanwilder · 08-16-2005, 05:25 PM

great post, ill come back here in a couple months when im cutting

**MurphMan** · 01-17-2006, 07:12 AM

I love it. So many people think they must gorge themselves to gain muscle, which isn't true.......any extra calories that are not used for building muscle are generally moved to fat storage. I've been preaching that for a long time. Too many people I see bulking, gain unecessary fat.

BMR is not an absolute measurment since most (especially noobs) are not disciplined enough to stick with a certain routine for excercise and diet. But it does give the person a guidline for future reference to compare their gains (or loss') based upon their diet and training program.

Kudos Rad! :bigthumbu

**A.FreeRadical** · 01-17-2006, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MurphMan

I love it. So many people think they must gorge themselves to gain muscle, which isn't true.......any extra calories that are not used for building muscle are generally moved to fat storage. I've been preaching that for a long time. Too many people I see bulking, gain unecessary fat.

BMR is not an absolute measurment since most (especially noobs) are not disciplined enough to stick with a certain routine for excercise and diet. But it does give the person a guidline for future reference to compare their gains (or loss') based upon their diet and training program.

Kudos Rad! :bigthumbu

Yes, for us endomorphs, losing control in a bulk requires unnecessary cutting later. BMR is really just a starting point.

My metabolism is slower than most calculators predict. I used one for my last bulk. I bulked up 9 lbs in 2 weeks. (I wasn't cheating, just eating too much for my metabolism. I had previously cycled off of creatine and added it in during the bulk.) I used fitday to calculate my average caloric consumption during those two weeks. I figured I had gained 5 lbs from going back on creatine and 4 lbs from overeating. (Still too much for a 2 week bulk) I did the math and cut the bmr + activity level back by 600 calories for my cut.

I peaked at 200 lbs last Friday. It is coming off slowly, I think. I am close, but may have to cut back another 100-200 lbs/day to get where I need to be. That is, losing 1 lb per week until the first week of May. If I don't, I will not be ready for the NABBA competition that I plan on competing in.

That is a long-winded way of saying, I agree, I can relate and Thanks.

*

JB20 · 03-08-2006, 01:43 AM

my lean body mass is 166 so for me to cut and lose fat i would need to eat under 2000 calories a day?first time i tried to cut i did cardio on an empty stomach and was eating around 2500 calories a day. i ended up losing muscle and strenght and still had a gut. i want to cut again as i am 200pds with 21% bf but im worried about losing muscle and not fat so i have been hesitant to try it again

**A.FreeRadical** · 03-08-2006, 02:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JB20

my lean body mass is 166 so for me to cut and lose fat i would need to eat under 2000 calories a day?first time i tried to cut i did cardio on an empty stomach and was eating around 2500 calories a day. i ended up losing muscle and strenght and still had a gut. i want to cut again as i am 200pds with 21% bf but im worried about losing muscle and not fat so i have been hesitant to try it again

You must also lift weights regularly and eat 40 grams of protein 6 times per day to maintain your muscle. I am not a fan of cardio on an empty stomach.

I started cutting 5 weeks ago when I hit 195 lbs. I have been eating 2000 calories per day. 6 meals per day with protein in every meal. I workout 6 days per week for an hour. I also brisk walk for an hour and a half each day for cardio. I have lost 9 lbs of fat so far. I don´t see any muscle loss yet.

*

JB20 · 03-08-2006, 02:22 AM

yeah i know the basic's of lifting and eating but i am no expert. i started lifting in high school when i was 15 and i did not learn anything about diet until i found bb.com and started to read the articles a little over 2 years ago when i was 19 im going on 21 at the end of march and i am the biggest and strongest i have ever been but by no means the leanest like i was in high school. some ways it's good and other ways it's bad

08-14-2005, 12:04 AM	#1
A.FreeRadical the Epicurean Bodybuilder Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 2,245 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 57	Macronutrient Ratios, Fat Loss and Muscle Gain (This is an article that I wrote several months ago. GameDayDog seems like he is getting serious about using the nutrition card to help get him where he wants to go bodybuilding-wise, so I thought I would post it here for his use (or anyone else's for that matter.) I don't know how long I might be able to access bb.com so I thought I better grab this while I can.) Everyone has pet peeves. How people use macronutrient ratios here in these forums is one of mine. That peeve is what prompted me to write this article. I see people posting ratio recommendations like 40/40/20, 45/40/15, 35/35/30, etc as if their ratio was inspired by divine inspiration to make all dietary nutrition self-evident. They offer these pearls of wisdom to folks who want to know how to eat to lose fat and gain muscle. These recommendations are meaningless for a person to determine a balanced diet for fat loss. If someone wants to lose fat, gain muscle or maintain weight, other information is needed first. Giving a ratio is ass backwards from what is needed. (Of course, what foods you actually eat are important too, but I am not going into that here.) The examples below will show you how to calculate your own ratio for fat loss. (If you want to maintain or gain weight, you can use a deficit of zero (0) or a surplus in the calculations.) What basic information do I need to calculate my requirements? First, you have to calculate how many calories you burn per day. There are many online calculators to determine this. (http://www.fitday.com is one.) You need to know your basal burn, your everyday activities burn and your exercise activities burn. These added together are your daily caloric burn. For this discussion, a person weighing 188 lbs, who works out vigorously and does cardio, will burn about 3000 calories per day. For the days he doesn't workout and doesn’t do cardio he will burn about 2500 calories per day. You need to know how much you weigh and how much body fat you have. (See the hundreds of threads at bodybuilding.com for determining body fat %.) From this you can determine lbs. of body fat and lbs. lean body mass (LBM). (Subtract body fat lbs from body weight to determine LBM.) How many calories can I consume and yet lose weight? It is generally believed that 1-2 lbs of fat is the optimum amount of fat to lose per week.. Anymore than this is stressful, may cause muscle tissue loss and is likely to be easily regained. A pound of fat is about 3500 calories. Theoretically, to lose 1 lb of fat you would have to have a caloric deficit (consume less calories than burned) of 3500 calories per week (500 calories per day). For a 2 lb loss per week you would have a deficit that is twice as much. Can my calorie deficit be too high? This is another consideration. There is a limit to how low your caloric consumption can go. You cannot have a deficit that is too large or your body will go into starvation mode. (Starvation mode, is when your body determines that adding fat is more important to its survival than preserving muscle mass.) If you don't eat enough you will likely gain fat and lose muscle. Your weight may remain unchanged or (you may get smaller with more fat). It is generally believed that your caloric deficit limit is about 10-12 times your LBM. For example, if LBM is 165 then you should eat at least 1650-1981 per day. You can see that a person burning 2500 calories per day can't cut 1000 calories from his diet without going into starvation mode. He has to burn more (weight training and/or cardio) or he uses a smaller deficit. Someone who is much heavier or someone that burns more exercise calories could try the full 1000 calories. (Are you starting to get an idea why your macronutrient ratio may not work for someone else?) Can I gain muscle while losing fat? Yes, you can do both. It is a tricky balancing act, but small amounts of muscle can be gained while losing 1 – 2 lbs per week. If losing fat is all about having the right calorie deficit in your diet and burning the right amount of calories with daily activities and cardio, keeping or gaining muscle is about weight training. To gain muscle you must do a sufficiently rigorous weight training program to work all muscles at least once per week. This program should include training sessions from 3 – 5 days per week and should last for 45 –60 minutes per session. My preference, while losing, weight is a program that uses minimal sets, with weight close to a lifter’s maximum for 4-6 repetitions. It should emphasize compound movement exercises (squats, benches, deadlifts, rows). There should be rest 2-3 minutes between sets. Lifting control should be with the negative and should explode with the positive. Other programs will work, but the one I describe here works well while doing a calorie-restricted diet. Remember, your energy is not going to be as high as if you were eating a maintenance level of calories. I have managed to gain about .5 lbs. per week of muscles, while losing fat, over an extended period of time using what I have described here. Your mileage may vary. For more information see http://www.ast-ss.com/. For information on muscles and exercises see http://www.exrx.net/Exercise.html. How much protein do I need? You need a factor of 1-1.5 x your LBM to make sure you have adequate protein for body repair and muscle growth. A factor of 1 is probably ok if you aren’t looking for much muscle growth. So in this example lets say a person is 188 lbs and has 12.2% body fat. That is 23 lbs of body fat. 188 – 23 = 165 lbs of lean body mass. Our hypothetical person wants to try for some muscle growth. We will use a protein factor of 1.2 and multiply times 165 = 198 grams of protein needed. There are 4 calories in every gram of protein so that equals 792 calories. For someone on a 2000-calorie per day diet, the protein calories to total calorie consumption ratio is 40% How much dietary fat do I need? This is more controversial, but here is my take on it. We need to consume fats to have healthy bodies. It is generally recommended that fats should not represent more than 30% of our caloric intake. It is also recommended that good fats (mono unsaturated and poly unsaturated) should be predominant over bad fats (saturated, trans fats, hydrogenised, etc.) Fat is very calorie dense, 9 calories per gram. I haven't seen a lower limit for fats, but I know it is very easy to consume 20% fat even on the strictest of diets. (You should include your fish oil, flaxseed oil, salad dressings, olive oil, peanut butter fats and oils from nuts as well as those lean hamburgers and fats in low fat foods.) So a using 20-30% range we can calculate how many grams and calories of fats are needed. I will use 25% in this example. If we have determined that we are burning 3000 calories per day (with exercise) and we are going to consume 2000 calories (a 1000 calorie deficit for fat loss), our fat will be 25% of 2000 calories = 500 calories. Divide 500 calories by 9 for grams = 55 grams of fat. What about carbohydrates, how many do I need? We have already determined that, in this example, protein should be 40% and fat should be 25% of a 2000-calorie diet (for this one person, who weighs 188 lbs and has a LBM of 165 lbs who burns 3000 calories per day, who wants to add muscle mass by using a rigorous exercise program, including weight training.) 2000 calories- 792 from protein - 500 from fats = 708 carbs calories divided by 4 per gram = 177 carbs. In this instance, this is 35% carbs. (I know some people have success with weight training and fat loss using low carb diets. I am not one of them. Carbohydrates are our primary source of energy. At a minimum, you should have sufficient carbs prior to workout and post workout.) So... what is the ideal ratio? What is ideal, and for whom? What is ideal for you is what will get you to your fat loss and muscle gain goals. This hypothetical person, weighing 188, LBM of 165, doing rigorous exercise, consuming 1.2 x LBM in protein, who consumes 500 calories worth of fats and who wants to lose 2 lbs of fat per week (using the formulas above) will end up with a 40/35/25 p/c/f ratio. There is no way anyone could have predicted this ratio without knowing his personal information, his assumptions for factors and the calculations from above. I have tried to make this explanation as simple as I possible can. In summary, to make this work for you, you will need to calculate how many calories you burn in a day you will need to get a reasonably close estimate of your body fat %, you will have to decide on protein factors 1-1.5 x LBM is a big spread. (1.2 should be enough. A higher number increases protein and reduces carbs. You need carbs for energy. No point in overdoing protein.) You will have to determine your deficit limits. (To see if at 10-12 x LBM you are flirting with starvation mode. Otherwise, go with 1000 calories per week max.) After you have done all of this, you must track your progress in detail. If you don’t have enough energy you will have to up your carbs. If you aren’t gaining any muscle, you will have to up your protein and your weight training. If you lack energy and are not gaining muscle, you may have to lower your deficit and lose fewer lbs. per week. Bottom line, this is all about you. Your ratio is only good so long as it is doing what you want it to be doing for you. Ok, now you know how to do it. The next time someone else tells you to use his ratio, send him this article and tell him to make sure he has his ratio right first. Chances are, he is using someone else’s ratio. Other resources: Lifting for Fat Loss–10 Take Home Points http://t-nation.com/readTopic.do;js...titan?id=517831 * __________________ "Is it going to be the red pill or the blue pill, Neo? The red pill will answer the question 'What is the Matrix?' Choose carefully. Remember, all I'm offering is the truth. Nothing more." Ron Paul for President, 2008 A.FreeRadical ...the Epicurean bodybuilder Height: 5'9", Age: 62, My last high on 2/1/2006 was 196 lbs. My last low on 8/08/2006 was 167.5 lbs. Cutting until I am lean Starting weight: 190 lbs. bodyfat: 19.7% November 27th: 183 lbs. bodyfat: 18.3% bodyfat Goal Weight: 176 lbs with no more than 10% bodyfat My recipe collection

08-16-2005, 05:25 PM	#2
vanwilder IMPC Contestant Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: calgary Posts: 728 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 13	Macronutrient Ratios, Fat Loss and Muscle Gain great post, ill come back here in a couple months when im cutting __________________ me > yourmom

03-08-2006, 01:43 AM	#5
JB20 Heavy Metal Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 663 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 40	my lean body mass is 166 so for me to cut and lose fat i would need to eat under 2000 calories a day?first time i tried to cut i did cardio on an empty stomach and was eating around 2500 calories a day. i ended up losing muscle and strenght and still had a gut. i want to cut again as i am 200pds with 21% bf but im worried about losing muscle and not fat so i have been hesitant to try it again __________________ http://sonybmg.com/musicbox/video/aliceinchains/

03-08-2006, 02:22 AM	#7
JB20 Heavy Metal Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 663 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 40	yeah i know the basic's of lifting and eating but i am no expert. i started lifting in high school when i was 15 and i did not learn anything about diet until i found bb.com and started to read the articles a little over 2 years ago when i was 19 im going on 21 at the end of march and i am the biggest and strongest i have ever been but by no means the leanest like i was in high school. some ways it's good and other ways it's bad __________________ http://sonybmg.com/musicbox/video/aliceinchains/

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

01-17-2006, 07:12 AM	#3
MurphMan Robomoderator Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 1,907 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 30	I love it. So many people think they must gorge themselves to gain muscle, which isn't true.......any extra calories that are not used for building muscle are generally moved to fat storage. I've been preaching that for a long time. Too many people I see bulking, gain unecessary fat. BMR is not an absolute measurment since most (especially noobs) are not disciplined enough to stick with a certain routine for excercise and diet. But it does give the person a guidline for future reference to compare their gains (or loss') based upon their diet and training program. Kudos Rad! :bigthumbu