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Old 01-03-2006, 04:25 PM   #1
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I'm gonna ask for help here and see if the combined knowledge here, we can get my diet and supplementing down pat. I'm thinking about competing this upcoming June at a local show, then hopefully go onto bigger and better things and come into the Teen Nationals by 2007.

Ideally I'd like to come in around 200-205lbs at 5-7% bodyfat and bone dry. Offeason right now I'm 216 around 13% and holding little water. I've taken about a month break to have some sanity, but I plan to start back into the gym hardcore. I have lost a little strength but nothing to cry about, less than I thoguht I would have over the past month off training. My size hasn't gone up or down much, but it seems like I'm "deflating" and my muscles aren't as full as they were when my carb levels were higher.

My previous mass diet was fairly good, it centered around protein and carbs staying high with low-moderate fat. I was eating an average of 4500 calories, ~450g protein, ~400g carbs, and whatever I would get from fat would mostly come from meats and EFA's. No outside fat sources like butter or olive oil.

My idea of diet and training coming through the new year is this though.

5:45AM - Wake Up

Pre-Cardo: Protein shake, 2 Scoops Protein Powder
Estimated Totals: 50g Protein
6:00AM - Gym, 45min Low Intensity Cardio

7:00AM - 1/2 Pound Lean Burger, 8 Egg Whites, 4 Slice Whole Grain Toast, Sugar Free Jam
Estimated Totals: ~80g Protein, 75g Carb, Minimal Fat
+3 Tablespoons Olive Oil (EFA), Vitamins, Green Tea

11:00AM - 8oz Lean Meat, 2 Cup Cooked Rice, 1/2 Pound Mixed Veggies
Estimated Totals: 50g Protein, 100g Carb, Minimal Fat
+3 Tablespoons Olive Oil (EFA), Vitamin, Green Tea

2:30PM - 8oz Chicken, 1 Can Yams
Estimated Totals: 60g Protein, 80g Carb
+Green Tea, XTend

-Workout 3:00PM-

PWO: 2 scoop protein powder, 4 scoop gatorade powder
Estimated Totals: 50g Protein, 80g Carb
+5g Creatine Mono, Green Tea, Glutamine

4:30-5:00 - 8oz Lean Meat, 1 Can Yams, 1/2 Pound mixed veggies
Estimated Totals: 50 Protein, 80g Carb, Minimal Fat
+Green Tea

7:00 - 8z Lean Meat, 1/2 Cup Roasted Nuts
Estimated Totals: 70g Protein, Minimal Carbs, 30g Fat
+Green Tea

9:00 - 8oz Lean Meat, 1 Pound Mixed Veggies, cooked with olive oil
Estimated Totals: 50g Protein, Minimal Carbs, 20-30g Fat
+Green Tea, Glutamne, ZMA, Creatine, Melatonin

Totals: 460g / 335g / 60g
Total Cals: 1840 / 1340 / 540 / 3720

That's Pro/Carb/Fat. I'm not counting trace carbs or trace fat in foods, or incomplete protein sources (breads, veggies, etc).

I'll post up my training a little later once diet is in order, I'll be gradually increasing calories again as I get back into training more and more. Maybe add a few more shakes and going to increase carbs over time till I'm around 400-450g again.

I'll just be using a cheap multi, figuring most nutrients I need will come from foods. This is just a 'ideal' diet plan, it may change over the day or I may substitute a meal but that's the basic breakdown of how thigns will look.
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Old 01-03-2006, 11:55 PM   #2
eating more folate...
 
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\Your diet looks similar to mine. It looks like. You, like myself, have a slight majority of your calories coming from protein. If you have the means, this is okay, but when it comes to optimal anabolism and T levels, your carbs shoud definately outweigh your protein. I find my gains shoot up when I increase my carbs. I do a form of carb cycling, where for 1 week I keep my carbs at 50% of my diet, protein at 35% and fats at 15%. This is my loading phase where I go extra heavy and add a fourth day in my split dedicated to deadlifting and squating. This day is in a addition to my normal split which includes a rack pulls and moderately heavy leg work.
The other two weeks look like the one you have listed. It is not do to say I don't grow well during these two weeks (because I DEF do), it is only I find my body reactes better to varying carb levels.

Don't skimp on the multi, especially on a bulk. For me at least, I don't get nearly the amount of veggies and fruits on a bulk than I do on a cut. Simply because they are too filling and also bulk around 4500 kcals. But this is just me. PM me if u want to chat more about it. We have similar situations, only I am about 20 lbs lighter.
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Old 01-04-2006, 12:27 AM   #3
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First, I must say how impress I am that as a teen you have this much dedication and appear to have the diet down. I agree with DJSTARER on the carbs. I like carb cycling through the week, normal days I shoot for a 40-40-20 macro, workout days I bump the carbs up slightly to more like a 35-45-20 but the pro is the same I add calories (ie. post w/o drink) and on heavy back and leg days I will add another 200-300 calories as carbs as a second post training meal about one hour after my workout. Normally 20-30 grams whey and 50-75 grams moderate GI carbs. Also add the multi and some antoxidents post w/o with the first shake. I find 1 gram of C and 400 iu E to really aid in recovery. Keep up the good work, your developing a really solid foundation!

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Old 01-04-2006, 01:43 AM   #4
eating more folate...
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sulcop
First, I must say how impress I am that as a teen you have this much dedication and appear to have the diet down. I agree with DJSTARER on the carbs. I like carb cycling through the week, normal days I shoot for a 40-40-20 macro, workout days I bump the carbs up slightly to more like a 35-45-20 but the pro is the same I add calories (ie. post w/o drink) and on heavy back and leg days I will add another 200-300 calories as carbs as a second post training meal about one hour after my workout. Normally 20-30 grams whey and 50-75 grams moderate GI carbs. Also add the multi and some antoxidents post w/o with the first shake. I find 1 gram of C and 400 iu E to really aid in recovery. Keep up the good work, your developing a really solid foundation!

Sully

Right on with two points. My leg days do tend to eat a ton more kcals than say... my chest. I also do my multi PWO in my dextrose and whey shake. I take the opportune insulin sensitivity to get those nutrients where they need to be.
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Penn State Powerlifting-181 lb weightclass

PGA Professional of America


Current Stats:
474 Squat
601 Deadlift
320 Bench


Goals for next training cycle:

500lbs squat and a total over 1400 in competition


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Old 01-04-2006, 02:11 AM   #5
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I'm trying to keep my carb levels low for the start since I'm just trying to work my way back into it. When I was at the peak right before I took a month break I had around 480g protein and 500-550g carb in my diet. I'm ultimately hoping to get back to those levels for the time being I just see protein as a better source of calories trying to start out especially trying to get my BF in check before I start adding more carbs.

Thing is, I'm about 13% bodyfat right now. I'd ultimately like to stay where I can see abs, that way when I'm on full-out diet I can tell the changes in my body whether I'm bloating (less definition in abs, thicker skin in water) as compared to when I'm with no abs I can't notice the little things like that. So hopefully about a month into this new diet I can have my bodyfat levels in check and get things around to the point that I can notice these changes in my body and how it's reacting to more carbs, less carbs, more water, more protein, less protein, more fat, etc.

I should have also mentioned what I do on non-workout days with diet but that's not really a big deal, it's pretty much macro wise but I've just got a meal instead of the PWO shake, the carbs PWO are from gatorade powder ... which is mainly dextrose and sucrose. My next bulk order with *********** will have some dextrose in it aswell.

I never thought about adding the multi PWO, that's probally a good idea. Well, one serving morning one after workout. What would be good for antoxidents though? I know I eat enough mixed veggies (I say mixed veggies because it's either frozen brocolli, carrots, or the veggie stir-fry mix) and they're a great for their antitoxidents in the food.

I know I get the worst gas in the world when I'm eating 3 pounds of brocolli a day
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Old 01-04-2006, 02:33 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Sholiz
I should have also mentioned what I do on non-workout days with diet but that's not really a big deal, it's pretty much macro wise but I've just got a meal instead of the PWO shake, the carbs PWO are from gatorade powder ... which is mainly dextrose and sucrose. My next bulk order with *********** will have some dextrose in it aswell.

I never thought about adding the multi PWO, that's probally a good idea. Well, one serving morning one after workout. What would be good for antoxidents though? I know I eat enough mixed veggies (I say mixed veggies because it's either frozen brocolli, carrots, or the veggie stir-fry mix) and they're a great for their antitoxidents in the food.

I know I get the worst gas in the world when I'm eating 3 pounds of brocolli a day

I also use gatorade mix PWO. Yum, and non of that fructose you find in the bottled stuff.

And I'm glad you see the importance of a multi on a bulk now. I can't stand being bloated from all those veggies.
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My philosophies on training:

"Extreme training yields extreme results"

"Just because you can, does not mean you should"

"The best program is the one you are not doing"






Penn State Powerlifting-181 lb weightclass

PGA Professional of America


Current Stats:
474 Squat
601 Deadlift
320 Bench


Goals for next training cycle:

500lbs squat and a total over 1400 in competition


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Old 01-04-2006, 04:07 PM   #7
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Yep! I love the powder, mix it with some vanilla whey and it's an A+ drink. Tastes like fruity vanilla, it's pretty fricken good. I know I hate vanilla whey straight, but with the gatorade powder ... I can tolerate it.

That or I mix in sugar-free tang, that works too.
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Old 01-04-2006, 04:53 PM   #8
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Kick ass bro... It would awesome seeing you step on stage.
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Old 01-04-2006, 08:39 PM   #9
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Anyone got more comments on the diet itself? Please *puppy dog eyes*
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Old 01-04-2006, 10:07 PM   #10
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Anyone got more comments on the diet itself? Please *puppy dog eyes*
I'm just watching and waiting cause I want to copy yours if you get a solid one.
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Old 01-04-2006, 10:12 PM   #11
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first question i must ask is are you natural or do you take AAS or prohormones, this will help dictate the amount of protein your able to push, your diet looks good, i notice the carb cuttoff at what 5-6pm if you religiously stick with that and keep the morning cardio at least three days a week then don't consern your self with cycling or cutting down the carbs, to be big you gotta eat big, and if you want to compete at 200-205 then you got some muscle to put on, cause currently at 216 with your bodyfat you would probably come in somewhere in the 180's, so you better get to eating and lifting some heavy slag iron, keep the carbcutoff and keep the cardio at least three days a week and keep the carbs, and slowly increase cals by increasing good fats! thats my 2 cents! take it for what its worth!

good luck and kick ass!
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Old 01-04-2006, 10:28 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b-boy
first question i must ask is are you natural or do you take AAS or prohormones, this will help dictate the amount of protein your able to push, your diet looks good, i notice the carb cuttoff at what 5-6pm if you religiously stick with that and keep the morning cardio at least three days a week then don't consern your self with cycling or cutting down the carbs, to be big you gotta eat big, and if you want to compete at 200-205 then you got some muscle to put on, cause currently at 216 with your bodyfat you would probably come in somewhere in the 180's, so you better get to eating and lifting some heavy slag iron, keep the carbcutoff and keep the cardio at least three days a week and keep the carbs, and slowly increase cals by increasing good fats! thats my 2 cents! take it for what its worth!

good luck and kick ass!
Hey Brad do you have a sample diet of what your doing? I'm looking to clean up my diet and I want a solid framework.
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Old 01-04-2006, 11:10 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b-boy
first question i must ask is are you natural or do you take AAS or prohormones, this will help dictate the amount of protein your able to push, your diet looks good, i notice the carb cuttoff at what 5-6pm if you religiously stick with that and keep the morning cardio at least three days a week then don't consern your self with cycling or cutting down the carbs, to be big you gotta eat big, and if you want to compete at 200-205 then you got some muscle to put on, cause currently at 216 with your bodyfat you would probably come in somewhere in the 180's, so you better get to eating and lifting some heavy slag iron, keep the carbcutoff and keep the cardio at least three days a week and keep the carbs, and slowly increase cals by increasing good fats! thats my 2 cents! take it for what its worth!

good luck and kick ass!
No AAS or PH ... I'm 16 bro! given it thought but got plenty of time to do it in the future.

The carb cutoff is relegious, I dont want the BF to creep up on me. DC-style diet I guess, I know I need more good fats but morning has a lot of pro-carb meals. Cardio is everyday usually, might miss a day a week tops when I just feel like sleeping in.

I don't want to cut the carbs down anymore or I think I'll just be purely lazy. Like I said before I want to come into contest 200-205, and I know I'd come in about 180 right now. Got a half year or so to pack on a good 10 pounds .. maybe 15 and I'd be happy with 190-195 contest time.

So, more cals over tiem (obviously with more size and metabolic increases) but add more good fats and carbs? I know protein will come up aswell because I'll probally try to fit another shake in there somewhere. Maybe add carbs with shake #1 after cardio, some maltodextrin or something.
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Old 01-04-2006, 11:35 PM   #14
eating more folate...
 
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Carbs are always a very argued issue. If carbs make you fat, then do what you are planning. If they do only in considerable excess, then watch them. The fact is, there really isn't a more anablic nutrient than the carbohydrate. People tend to overlook this. If you are doing cardio, I would attempt to keep carbs (comlex of course) in all my meals but two (around bed). Even then, if I feel I havn't gotten enough, i'll down a bowl of oats before bed. I have my endo qualities too, but during a bulk (clean, or whatever you may call it), carbs are SOOO important. If ur a Jonny B nut, that is fine. I know I am. Just don't overdo the mixing. A handful of peanuts at a carb meal won't hurt you... maybe bloat, but that is personal. You are young, and are still producing the great horomones for building mass. I know you are eager to compete, but frankly, these next few year will be key for you to lay on a really thick foundation. I guess what I am trying to say, is grow muscle, keep an eye on flat, but don't let it crunch ur ability to pack on lean mass. Strict dieting can waste one's anabolic ability.

To sum it up, a great newbie once said: "Dude, my roomate always orders pizza, so I always eat it. But i'll tell you, I've made the greatest gains of my life while doing this. Sure, I gained some fat, but man, all my lifts went through the roof."
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My philosophies on training:

"Extreme training yields extreme results"

"Just because you can, does not mean you should"

"The best program is the one you are not doing"






Penn State Powerlifting-181 lb weightclass

PGA Professional of America


Current Stats:
474 Squat
601 Deadlift
320 Bench


Goals for next training cycle:

500lbs squat and a total over 1400 in competition


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Old 01-05-2006, 11:23 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sholiz
2:30PM - 8oz Chicken, 1 Can Yams
Estimated Totals: 60g Protein, 80g Carb
+Green Tea, XTend

-Workout 3:00PM-
I would eat that meal more than 30 mins from the workout, I know I would get sick eating it that close.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sholiz
I never thought about adding the multi PWO, that's probally a good idea. Well, one serving morning one after workout. What would be good for antoxidents though? I know I eat enough mixed veggies (I say mixed veggies because it's either frozen brocolli, carrots, or the veggie stir-fry mix) and they're a great for their antitoxidents in the food.
For post workout antioxidants take

1 g vitamin C
500 mg Green Tea
400 iu vitamin E
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Old 01-05-2006, 12:09 PM   #16