Liftin Raw

**powerman2000** · 04-30-2005, 08:21 AM

No, I don't mean doing your squats nekked.

I'm talking about lifting with or without supportive gear.

No, I'm not talking about using Steroids. (been there, done that)

I am talking about using a PL belt and or knee wraps.

When I was at my best in the 1980s, yes I did say 80, the term "raw" usually referred only to meat products or eggs. We always used a belt and wraps when we went heavy as PLs will tend to do.

Recently, I've been squating and doing my DLs without a belt and I've been going without knee wraps for quite a while now.

What do you guys think about lifting raw. Should you do it as far as you can and then when you strap on the equipment (me looking around for lesbians) would you expect to have more success with your belt and wraps than if you hadn't lifted first without them?

I know I cannot lift as much without a belt and wraps and I know they help me prevent injury. At least that is my opinion on the injury thing. I've been having a little bit of a tough time on my back without the belt. Particularly in the DL. I can't keep my waist tight on the way back down to the floor. Singles are fine, but reps are difficult. I pulled 405 without a belt very easily, but as I said going back to the floor causes me to loosen up too much where a 2nd rep isn't safely do-able.

Anyway, thoughts and experiences please, if you have any.

**warriors** · 04-30-2005, 02:05 PM

the only time i use a belt is when i go for a max on DL or squats although i used to never use a belt and IMO it does feel better when u put up a PR without anything but ur clothes on

sfiximo · 04-30-2005, 06:43 PM

I dont even know how to use a belt properly, ive spent 50$ on a Twinlab triple leather belt and whenever I wear it my lower back hurts...
I think its OK to lift with a belt and knee wraps, but using a powerlifting suit is just pathetic. Bench shirts probably add 300 pounds to someones bench, squat suits add another 300, its pointless. Some day the lifts will depend on the suit thats used than the strength of the lifter. The only lift I like seeing is deadlifts because straps are illegal

JournalistBT · 05-01-2005, 12:45 AM

Wow, we have some passionate and hardcore lifters at the powerlifting forum! I disagree with sfix, that bench shirts add 300lbs to ones lifts in most situations. They add 300lbs to guys lifts that only train for the shirt, who are natural with the shirts and don't care about RAW benching. In fact, they add up to 450lbs, to one's RAW max, example Gene R. However, not anyone can put a shirt on and add 300lbs, they take time to learn and use the shirts first. I believe in a few years we will see 1500+ pounds being benched and some people being killed.

I agree with warrior, that you shouldn't always use a belts, etc, unless maxing. You need to use stabilzers for real strength+ balance. However, I only agree with warrior in individual circumstances some lifters need them to prevent injuries, etc. All depends man. Nice posting, everyone.

kwyckemynd00 · 05-01-2005, 04:14 AM

I know a lot of PLers don't care what kind of RAW numbers they put up, but I personally would love to see it. I mean, I've got nothing but respect for PLers and think PL is a great way to build a foundation of muscle and strength to gain your mass from.

However, I hear so much trash talking on BBers who can't lift for shit, etc, etc, but, how much more would these PLers be lifting if they were RAW? I know that the best RAW bench is 800+lbs, and the best DL is 930lbs, but what about squat RAW?

I mean, I'm sure ruhl, coleman could bench 600+lbs easily RAW. I know johnny jackson and coleman can both DL over 800lbs, and i've seen coleman squat 800 for two (a little bit too high though) with a single-ply suit.

I think RAW numbers should be of some importance, too...

sfiximo · 05-01-2005, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JournalistBT

Wow, we have some passionate and hardcore lifters at the powerlifting forum! I disagree with sfix, that bench shirts add 300lbs to ones lifts in most situations. They add 300lbs to guys lifts that only train for the shirt, who are natural with the shirts and don't care about RAW benching. In fact, they add up to 450lbs, to one's RAW max, example Gene R. However, not anyone can put a shirt on and add 300lbs, they take time to learn and use the shirts first. I believe in a few years we will see 1500+ pounds being benched and some people being killed.

I agree with warrior, that you shouldn't always use a belts, etc, unless maxing. You need to use stabilzers for real strength+ balance. However, I only agree with warrior in individual circumstances some lifters need them to prevent injuries, etc. All depends man. Nice posting, everyone.

Im too stupid to see why its fun to see people bench with a shirt thats going to push most of the weight. Can you tell me why its good?
Hell why dont we put shock absorbers in each side of the barbell, maybe a rubber band connected from the roof to the barbell, or even put an engine on the lifters stomach which will push the weight up for him?

**warriors** · 05-02-2005, 05:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfiximo

Im too stupid to see why its fun to see people bench with a shirt thats going to push most of the weight. Can you tell me why its good?
Hell why dont we put shock absorbers in each side of the barbell, maybe a rubber band connected from the roof to the barbell, or even put an engine on the lifters stomach which will push the weight up for him?

To even think about winning a PL comp or even placing decent u have to wear some kind of suit b/c if not ur really at a disadvantage. It's like a natural bber trying to compete in the IFBB ranks with Cutler, Coleman, etc.

**powerman2000** · 05-06-2005, 06:24 AM

Well, here is my latest report on my "raw" lifting.

It SUCKS!

It has jacked my back up to the point that I'm going to have to lay off squats and deads for a couple of weeks.

I started doing it because I thought I might build some more muscle and strength around my torso. What was I thinking? :o

I've always been very good at pushing out on my PL belt with my abs, which is why my lower abdomens are a little over developed. Somebody please slap me for switching to "raw" after 20+ years of lifting with a belt.

One last comment on lifting raw, doing a single rep raw is much different than doing 10+ reps without a belt. I will still squat without the knee wraps.

apapresident · 05-11-2005, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by powerman2000

Well, here is my latest report on my "raw" lifting.

It SUCKS!

It has jacked my back up to the point that I'm going to have to lay off squats and deads for a couple of weeks.

I started doing it because I thought I might build some more muscle and strength around my torso. What was I thinking? :o

I've always been very good at pushing out on my PL belt with my abs, which is why my lower abdomens are a little over developed. Somebody please slap me for switching to "raw" after 20+ years of lifting with a belt.

One last comment on lifting raw, doing a single rep raw is much different than doing 10+ reps without a belt. I will still squat without the knee wraps.

I've been lifting for 42 years and can't stress enough the importance of wraps and belts. Had I known way back then what I know now I would not have the problems I have.

I am not suggesting going out and getting bench press shirts that add 100 pounds to your best etc. I remember the poly shirts that added maybe 10 pounds to your lift but protected the heck out of your joints. My knees are a mess because of raw squatting with 800+ pounds years ago and my doctor who was a lifter asked me if I was nuts for training like that.

I disagree with a lot of the newer equipment and do think some of it is an accident waiting to happen. However, sensible equipment will protect the joints, promote longevity in the sport, and will not get a lifter hurt. I love to hear the Johnny come lately's that talk like raw was here at the beginning of the sport. Thats the misconception they are led to believe. Back in the old days of the sport the only thing raw meant was uncooked steak. I remember elbow wraps, bedsheets wrapped around the knees with tennis balls behind the joint, etc.

The best approach is a sensible medium between raw and equipped or I guess it could be called "lightly equipped" for "heavy protection". Put on those belts, put on your wraps, and wear a light bench shirt and stick around the sport for another 20 years rather than cutting it short like so many of us oldtimers had to.

**powerman2000** · 05-12-2005, 07:17 AM

Great post Scott, thanks for joining. I hope that you will come here often and share your knowledge to all for their benefit. I've always said from the time I first began my PL career, every PLer I've ever meet is always encouraging and helping other PLers to be their best. It is just the great attitude that all PLers have for each other. Thanks again!

Testosterone · 05-12-2005, 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apapresident

I've been lifting for 42 years and can't stress enough the importance of wraps and belts. Had I known way back then what I know now I would not have the problems I have.

I am not suggesting going out and getting bench press shirts that add 100 pounds to your best etc. I remember the poly shirts that added maybe 10 pounds to your lift but protected the heck out of your joints. My knees are a mess because of raw squatting with 800+ pounds years ago and my doctor who was a lifter asked me if I was nuts for training like that.

I disagree with a lot of the newer equipment and do think some of it is an accident waiting to happen. However, sensible equipment will protect the joints, promote longevity in the sport, and will not get a lifter hurt. I love to hear the Johnny come lately's that talk like raw was here at the beginning of the sport. Thats the misconception they are led to believe. Back in the old days of the sport the only thing raw meant was uncooked steak. I remember elbow wraps, bedsheets wrapped around the knees with tennis balls behind the joint, etc.

The best approach is a sensible medium between raw and equipped or I guess it could be called "lightly equipped" for "heavy protection". Put on those belts, put on your wraps, and wear a light bench shirt and stick around the sport for another 20 years rather than cutting it short like so many of us oldtimers had to.

Great post!

kwyckemynd00 · 05-12-2005, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apapresident

I've been lifting for 42 years....

Great post!

What kind of shirt would you suggest working in? Just any old cheap singly ply? Thx!

apapresident · 05-17-2005, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwyckemynd00

Great post!

What kind of shirt would you suggest working in? Just any old cheap singly ply? Thx!

I always used either an old Inzer single ply poly blast shirt or from decades ago Force Brute in England made a shirt for 20 bucks that I loved.

04-30-2005, 08:21 AM	#1
powerman2000 The Old Moderator Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 4,188 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 202	Liftin Raw No, I don't mean doing your squats nekked. I'm talking about lifting with or without supportive gear. No, I'm not talking about using Steroids. (been there, done that) I am talking about using a PL belt and or knee wraps. When I was at my best in the 1980s, yes I did say 80, the term "raw" usually referred only to meat products or eggs. We always used a belt and wraps when we went heavy as PLs will tend to do. Recently, I've been squating and doing my DLs without a belt and I've been going without knee wraps for quite a while now. What do you guys think about lifting raw. Should you do it as far as you can and then when you strap on the equipment (me looking around for lesbians) would you expect to have more success with your belt and wraps than if you hadn't lifted first without them? I know I cannot lift as much without a belt and wraps and I know they help me prevent injury. At least that is my opinion on the injury thing. I've been having a little bit of a tough time on my back without the belt. Particularly in the DL. I can't keep my waist tight on the way back down to the floor. Singles are fine, but reps are difficult. I pulled 405 without a belt very easily, but as I said going back to the floor causes me to loosen up too much where a 2nd rep isn't safely do-able. Anyway, thoughts and experiences please, if you have any. __________________ Don't forget to periodize Best BP 507 lbs competitive Best Squat 705 lbs competitive Best DL 650 lbs competitive Guns don't kill people, men who come home early do. My workout log http://www.ironmass.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6247

04-30-2005, 02:05 PM	#2
warriors The world is yours Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,127 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 29	the only time i use a belt is when i go for a max on DL or squats although i used to never use a belt and IMO it does feel better when u put up a PR without anything but ur clothes on __________________ Not Around...

04-30-2005, 06:43 PM	#3
sfiximo Pro Stature Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: a Posts: 303 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 7	I dont even know how to use a belt properly, ive spent 50$ on a Twinlab triple leather belt and whenever I wear it my lower back hurts... I think its OK to lift with a belt and knee wraps, but using a powerlifting suit is just pathetic. Bench shirts probably add 300 pounds to someones bench, squat suits add another 300, its pointless. Some day the lifts will depend on the suit thats used than the strength of the lifter. The only lift I like seeing is deadlifts because straps are illegal __________________ check out my journal (its somewhere in the workout log section)

05-06-2005, 06:24 AM	#8
powerman2000 The Old Moderator Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 4,188 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 202	Well, here is my latest report on my "raw" lifting. It SUCKS! It has jacked my back up to the point that I'm going to have to lay off squats and deads for a couple of weeks. I started doing it because I thought I might build some more muscle and strength around my torso. What was I thinking? :o I've always been very good at pushing out on my PL belt with my abs, which is why my lower abdomens are a little over developed. Somebody please slap me for switching to "raw" after 20+ years of lifting with a belt. One last comment on lifting raw, doing a single rep raw is much different than doing 10+ reps without a belt. I will still squat without the knee wraps. __________________ Don't forget to periodize Best BP 507 lbs competitive Best Squat 705 lbs competitive Best DL 650 lbs competitive Guns don't kill people, men who come home early do. My workout log http://www.ironmass.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6247

05-12-2005, 07:17 AM	#10
powerman2000 The Old Moderator Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 4,188 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 202	Great post Scott, thanks for joining. I hope that you will come here often and share your knowledge to all for their benefit. I've always said from the time I first began my PL career, every PLer I've ever meet is always encouraging and helping other PLers to be their best. It is just the great attitude that all PLers have for each other. Thanks again! __________________ Don't forget to periodize Best BP 507 lbs competitive Best Squat 705 lbs competitive Best DL 650 lbs competitive Guns don't kill people, men who come home early do. My workout log http://www.ironmass.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6247

05-01-2005, 12:45 AM	#4
JournalistBT New Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 19 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 0	Wow, we have some passionate and hardcore lifters at the powerlifting forum! I disagree with sfix, that bench shirts add 300lbs to ones lifts in most situations. They add 300lbs to guys lifts that only train for the shirt, who are natural with the shirts and don't care about RAW benching. In fact, they add up to 450lbs, to one's RAW max, example Gene R. However, not anyone can put a shirt on and add 300lbs, they take time to learn and use the shirts first. I believe in a few years we will see 1500+ pounds being benched and some people being killed. I agree with warrior, that you shouldn't always use a belts, etc, unless maxing. You need to use stabilzers for real strength+ balance. However, I only agree with warrior in individual circumstances some lifters need them to prevent injuries, etc. All depends man. Nice posting, everyone.

05-01-2005, 04:14 AM	#5
kwyckemynd00 Amateur Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 34 Recipes: 0 Rep Power: 0	I know a lot of PLers don't care what kind of RAW numbers they put up, but I personally would love to see it. I mean, I've got nothing but respect for PLers and think PL is a great way to build a foundation of muscle and strength to gain your mass from. However, I hear so much trash talking on BBers who can't lift for shit, etc, etc, but, how much more would these PLers be lifting if they were RAW? I know that the best RAW bench is 800+lbs, and the best DL is 930lbs, but what about squat RAW? I mean, I'm sure ruhl, coleman could bench 600+lbs easily RAW. I know johnny jackson and coleman can both DL over 800lbs, and i've seen coleman squat 800 for two (a little bit too high though) with a single-ply suit. I think RAW numbers should be of some importance, too...

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